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	<title>Comments on: Are Bailouts Saving the U.S. from a New Great Depression?</title>
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	<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/</link>
	<description>The source on how we live, work and play</description>
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		<title>By: Mad Hemingway</title>
		<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/comment-page-1/#comment-11086</link>
		<dc:creator>Mad Hemingway</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 21:52:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/?p=9535#comment-11086</guid>
		<description>I voted for Obama, but based on what he&#039;s said, he&#039;ll continue the war in Afghanistan (increasing troops to 400K and keeping the Defense industry in business) and some of his cabinet-level picks like Geithner, Summmers, and keeping Bernanke, means that he&#039;s going down the road is Republican-lite.  On the health insurance front, single payer is off the table, so the insurance industry is still keeping health insurance artificially expensive.

Considering the deep financial hole that the US in, winding down Afghanistan is the first big area for savings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I voted for Obama, but based on what he&#8217;s said, he&#8217;ll continue the war in Afghanistan (increasing troops to 400K and keeping the Defense industry in business) and some of his cabinet-level picks like Geithner, Summmers, and keeping Bernanke, means that he&#8217;s going down the road is Republican-lite.  On the health insurance front, single payer is off the table, so the insurance industry is still keeping health insurance artificially expensive.</p>
<p>Considering the deep financial hole that the US in, winding down Afghanistan is the first big area for savings.</p>
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		<title>By: T-Rock</title>
		<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/comment-page-1/#comment-11076</link>
		<dc:creator>T-Rock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 16:23:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/?p=9535#comment-11076</guid>
		<description>Found this blog after Matt Yglesias linked to it.

I don&#039;t know where you learned your economic history, but there was never a point in the American economy when manufacturing constituted a majority of the labor force - in the 30s about as many people worked in agriculture as in manufacturing.

If you define the &quot;creative class&quot; as &quot;people in high-value added growth industries&quot;, which seems to be the case, of course they&#039;re not going to be fired during recessions to the same extent as people in &quot;low-value addded declining industries&quot;. That&#039;s tautological, not insightful.

And what on Earth do you mean that countries outside the US have been &quot;building and conserving their resources&quot; to invest? China is not sitting on $2 trillion in reserves because they&#039;re biding their time - they were already investing such vast amounts of money that their economy couldn&#039;t absorb more. If you think Japan is biding its time for something better to come along, you&#039;re crazy - that country is desperate for good ideas now. Who else is saving money? That&#039;s just feel-good pablum that doesn&#039;t reflect economic reality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Found this blog after Matt Yglesias linked to it.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know where you learned your economic history, but there was never a point in the American economy when manufacturing constituted a majority of the labor force &#8211; in the 30s about as many people worked in agriculture as in manufacturing.</p>
<p>If you define the &#8220;creative class&#8221; as &#8220;people in high-value added growth industries&#8221;, which seems to be the case, of course they&#8217;re not going to be fired during recessions to the same extent as people in &#8220;low-value addded declining industries&#8221;. That&#8217;s tautological, not insightful.</p>
<p>And what on Earth do you mean that countries outside the US have been &#8220;building and conserving their resources&#8221; to invest? China is not sitting on $2 trillion in reserves because they&#8217;re biding their time &#8211; they were already investing such vast amounts of money that their economy couldn&#8217;t absorb more. If you think Japan is biding its time for something better to come along, you&#8217;re crazy &#8211; that country is desperate for good ideas now. Who else is saving money? That&#8217;s just feel-good pablum that doesn&#8217;t reflect economic reality.</p>
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		<title>By: Swordsman</title>
		<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/comment-page-1/#comment-11066</link>
		<dc:creator>Swordsman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 06:30:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/?p=9535#comment-11066</guid>
		<description>Damn, Kevin, where have you been hiding?  Good thoughts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Damn, Kevin, where have you been hiding?  Good thoughts.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Carson</title>
		<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/comment-page-1/#comment-11065</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Carson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 05:27:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/?p=9535#comment-11065</guid>
		<description>Totally right about the overcapacity of the auto industry.  In fact, we&#039;ve got an entire economy organized on Sloanist mass production lines, relying on planned obsolescence and consumer debt to keep the wheels turning at full capacity.

Leaving aside the bailout issue, the main item on the plate should be 1) removing the subsidies and protections to the present centralized corporate economy, and 2) removing the barriers to a successor system coalescing out of the rubble.

Under the heading of #1, that means especially eliminating transportation subsidies (funding the Interstate with weight-based tolls on trucks, funding civil aviation ENTIRELY from its own revenues and eliminating eminent domain power for building and expanding airports) that promote artificially large market area and firm size.  It also means streamlining the tax code to eliminate special tax advantages for firms engaged in capital-intensive, high tech production and mergers and acquistion (e.g. the depreciation allowance, R&amp;D credit, subsidies to technical education, the interest deduction for corporate debt, the exemption of stock swaps from capital gains, etc.).

Under #2, fall--especially--zoning and &quot;safety&quot; regulations that impose mandatory minimum overhead costs on microenterprise, and thus effectively criminalize low-overhead, small-batch production in the household and informal sectors using &quot;spare cycles&quot; of ordinary household capital goods most people already own.  We need to elminate all the regulatory barriers to people running microbakeries with ordinary kitchen ovens, unlicensed cab services with a car and cell phone, etc.  And we need to eliminate the barriers to providing liquidity for barter between such producers through LETS systems, organizing networked microcredit through mutual banks and crowdsourcing, etc.  We also need to eliminate &quot;intellectual property&quot; as the main bulwark of many corporate walls against self-managed peer production by their own &quot;human capital,&quot; and as a legal barrier to modular design and generic replacement parts and other prerequisites of repair-and-recycling product design.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Totally right about the overcapacity of the auto industry.  In fact, we&#8217;ve got an entire economy organized on Sloanist mass production lines, relying on planned obsolescence and consumer debt to keep the wheels turning at full capacity.</p>
<p>Leaving aside the bailout issue, the main item on the plate should be 1) removing the subsidies and protections to the present centralized corporate economy, and 2) removing the barriers to a successor system coalescing out of the rubble.</p>
<p>Under the heading of #1, that means especially eliminating transportation subsidies (funding the Interstate with weight-based tolls on trucks, funding civil aviation ENTIRELY from its own revenues and eliminating eminent domain power for building and expanding airports) that promote artificially large market area and firm size.  It also means streamlining the tax code to eliminate special tax advantages for firms engaged in capital-intensive, high tech production and mergers and acquistion (e.g. the depreciation allowance, R&amp;D credit, subsidies to technical education, the interest deduction for corporate debt, the exemption of stock swaps from capital gains, etc.).</p>
<p>Under #2, fall&#8211;especially&#8211;zoning and &#8220;safety&#8221; regulations that impose mandatory minimum overhead costs on microenterprise, and thus effectively criminalize low-overhead, small-batch production in the household and informal sectors using &#8220;spare cycles&#8221; of ordinary household capital goods most people already own.  We need to elminate all the regulatory barriers to people running microbakeries with ordinary kitchen ovens, unlicensed cab services with a car and cell phone, etc.  And we need to eliminate the barriers to providing liquidity for barter between such producers through LETS systems, organizing networked microcredit through mutual banks and crowdsourcing, etc.  We also need to eliminate &#8220;intellectual property&#8221; as the main bulwark of many corporate walls against self-managed peer production by their own &#8220;human capital,&#8221; and as a legal barrier to modular design and generic replacement parts and other prerequisites of repair-and-recycling product design.</p>
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		<title>By: Swordsman</title>
		<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/comment-page-1/#comment-11058</link>
		<dc:creator>Swordsman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 23:13:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/?p=9535#comment-11058</guid>
		<description>Hemingway is correct.  U6 rather than U3 is much nearer the mark (see bls.gov).  As for Obama failing some test, he&#039;s been in office 2 fricking months and inherited two wars and the worst recession in 80 years.  How about cutting him some slack?

What we need is a paradigm shift in how we think of cities, of jobs, of finance, of government, and of transportation.  We&#039;ve let the 20th Century (and the first half of the 20th Century even) dictate to us for far too long.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hemingway is correct.  U6 rather than U3 is much nearer the mark (see bls.gov).  As for Obama failing some test, he&#8217;s been in office 2 fricking months and inherited two wars and the worst recession in 80 years.  How about cutting him some slack?</p>
<p>What we need is a paradigm shift in how we think of cities, of jobs, of finance, of government, and of transportation.  We&#8217;ve let the 20th Century (and the first half of the 20th Century even) dictate to us for far too long.</p>
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		<title>By: Mad Hemingway</title>
		<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/comment-page-1/#comment-11047</link>
		<dc:creator>Mad Hemingway</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:33:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/?p=9535#comment-11047</guid>
		<description>Richard, the way unemployment was measured during the 1930s and today are different.  They changed that back after Carter.  The real unemployment rate is closer to 17%-18%.    

Obama&#039;s failing his first big test.  His proclamation about &quot;change&quot; remains as vague today as it did when he was campaigning.  And because of that, he&#039;ll be viewed as Bush-lite if he doesn&#039;t change course.

Maybe people should send Geithner and Summers the big red Bozo nose, since they&#039;ve taken on the roles of corporate clowns.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard, the way unemployment was measured during the 1930s and today are different.  They changed that back after Carter.  The real unemployment rate is closer to 17%-18%.    </p>
<p>Obama&#8217;s failing his first big test.  His proclamation about &#8220;change&#8221; remains as vague today as it did when he was campaigning.  And because of that, he&#8217;ll be viewed as Bush-lite if he doesn&#8217;t change course.</p>
<p>Maybe people should send Geithner and Summers the big red Bozo nose, since they&#8217;ve taken on the roles of corporate clowns.</p>
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		<title>By: Elana</title>
		<link>http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/2009/03/18/are-the-bailouts-saving-us-from-a-new-great-depression/comment-page-1/#comment-11043</link>
		<dc:creator>Elana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:47:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creativeclass.com/_v3/creative_class/?p=9535#comment-11043</guid>
		<description>‘He who pays the piper calls the tune.’

With China being the cash behind United States’ “military adventures” and other funding, I wonder what their position and influence over US policy.  It is in the best interest of China to keep Americans spend-happy buying Chinese products where they turnaround and lead the money they receive back to them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>‘He who pays the piper calls the tune.’</p>
<p>With China being the cash behind United States’ “military adventures” and other funding, I wonder what their position and influence over US policy.  It is in the best interest of China to keep Americans spend-happy buying Chinese products where they turnaround and lead the money they receive back to them.</p>
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